zaneb94
New Member
Posts: 34
Location: Northern Michigan
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Post by zaneb94 on Mar 3, 2023 21:17:05 GMT
Hi, I'm currently running into issues with a CK rewiring process. This unit was in service for over a year without any cooling or starting issues, but the cord was starting to look like it needed to be replaced. I had my electrician friend follow the following reference points to replace the wiring and install a Supco relay as used by other members: monitortop.freeforums.net/thread/723/re-wired-ckmonitortop.freeforums.net/attachment/download/4203We used Green instead of red from the compressor contacts and 14 gauge wire three prong wiring. The electrician reviewed the following when performing the same steps listed in the video: - Green from bottom compressor contact to Red on Supco relay
- Black Common on Center contact to the temp unit before going to Black Common on Relay
- White Run wire from Relay connected directly to Top contact on compressor
We have tried two Supco relays during troubleshooting and found that both get the compressor to start spinning up, but then it stops after about 10 seconds. No indication that it actually started. Changing the temp control seems to make it try again when we wait several minutes.
Any thoughts would be appreciated. Soldering joints are firm.
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Post by turbokinetic on Mar 3, 2023 22:18:09 GMT
That is frustrating!
With Supco start devices; symptom of partial spin-up and then spin down, followed by overload trip is almost always caused by swapped Run and Start wiring.
The Supco relays use Red for Run; White for Start. GE used the same colors, but the symptom sure sounds like something's swapped around.
What are the resistance measurements from the compressor?
Common to Run should be about 4Ω
Common to Start should be around 12Ω
Start to Run should be the sum of the two; around 16Ω
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zaneb94
New Member
Posts: 34
Location: Northern Michigan
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Post by zaneb94 on Mar 3, 2023 22:38:21 GMT
I will get some readings on this later. I swapped the Run and Start winding cables on the relay and tested it, but we didn't get any spin-up on this attempt. I ensured the unit was set to Off before plugging into the wall.
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Post by turbokinetic on Mar 3, 2023 22:41:50 GMT
I will get some readings on this later. I swapped the Run and Start winding cables on the relay and tested it, but we didn't get any spin-up on this attempt. I ensured the unit was set to Off before plugging into the wall. That is very odd. Couple questions - was it working well with the original relay but not the Supco device? Which Supco device do you have? And forgive me for asking this but..... the compressor is upright during these start attempts, I hope? |
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zaneb94
New Member
Posts: 34
Location: Northern Michigan
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Post by zaneb94 on Mar 3, 2023 22:43:51 GMT
It was working well with the original relay, but it was starting to sound 'labored' when starting up. It was chattering quite a bit. The contacts on the original relay seem to be shot, but I could be wrong. All attempts to fire up were upright on the cabinet or hoist.
I have a Supco R081 relay. I'm wondering if I shouldn't return it to the original relay after cleaning the contacts a bit. I can attach pictures of the original if needed. There is a slight indent and they are blackish in color.
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Post by turbokinetic on Mar 3, 2023 22:51:52 GMT
It was working well with the original relay, but it was starting to sound 'labored' when starting up. It was chattering quite a bit. The contacts on the original relay seem to be shot, but I could be wrong. All attempts to fire up were upright on the cabinet or hoist. I have a Supco R081 relay. I'm wondering if I shouldn't return it to the original relay after cleaning the contacts a bit. I can attach pictures of the original if needed. There is a slight indent and they are blackish in color. I would go back to the original relay and see what's up with it. The labored start up and chattering is worrisome as this sounds like a mechanical problem possibly starting - such as some leak in the system allowing air to draw in and build up too much pressure. |
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zaneb94
New Member
Posts: 34
Location: Northern Michigan
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Post by zaneb94 on Mar 3, 2023 22:55:33 GMT
I don't recall seeing a back plate on the relay when it was pulled off. I noticed in the CK wiring video that one had to be fabricated. Would this be where too much air is getting in?
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Post by turbokinetic on Mar 3, 2023 22:58:41 GMT
I don't recall seeing a back plate on the relay when it was pulled off. I noticed in the CK wiring video that one had to be fabricated. Would this be where too much air is getting in? No; I was thinking about deteriorated or cracked solder joints on the sealed refrigeration system where air gets in with the SO2. The relay mount helps to make things more secure against shorts, and helps the relay stay upright, since it is position sensitive. |
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zaneb94
New Member
Posts: 34
Location: Northern Michigan
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Post by zaneb94 on Mar 4, 2023 2:42:26 GMT
Are there specific places I should try to re-seal? When I had it off the cabinet the lines looked fine. No refrigerant smell. I'm wondering if there also might be a process for clearing air from the system if that's happening.
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zaneb94
New Member
Posts: 34
Location: Northern Michigan
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Post by zaneb94 on Mar 4, 2023 14:59:45 GMT
I installed the old relay and can't get the unit to power back on.
CR 1057 E5 relay was the original
1. White from Compressor
2. Black from Power cord and Compressor
3. White from power cord
4. Green (was Red) from Compressor
This was the original configuration. Should something be changed? I'm hoping the compressor didn't die when things were changed around.
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Post by turbokinetic on Mar 4, 2023 15:16:16 GMT
I installed the old relay and can't get the unit to power back on. CR 1057 E5 relay was the original 1. White from Compressor 2. Black from Power cord and Compressor 3. White from power cord 4. Green (was Red) from Compressor This was the original configuration. Should something be changed? I'm hoping the compressor didn't die when things were changed around. Can you share a picture of the relay. Also, need to know the resistance values. This is extremely important. |
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zaneb94
New Member
Posts: 34
Location: Northern Michigan
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Post by zaneb94 on Mar 4, 2023 17:19:15 GMT
I've included images of the relay with and without the wiring attached. I believe my meter may be having issues reading correctly, so I'm gonna test with a new meter today. It looks like I was slightly wrong about the numbers listed from my last reply, but I mirrored this arrangement. Attachments:
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Post by turbokinetic on Mar 4, 2023 17:31:02 GMT
Thanks for the pictures.
That is the first design relay, which didn't come with a metal cover. The brass post just accepts a screw to hold the relay in position.
Let us know about the outcome of the resistance values when you get them.
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zaneb94
New Member
Posts: 34
Location: Northern Michigan
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Post by zaneb94 on Mar 4, 2023 17:53:09 GMT
I'm currently showing the following:
White to Green: 4 ohms
Black to Green: 23 Ohms
Black to White: 20 Ohms
Seems like a strange reading. I have this set to the continuity portion of the tester. My friend noted that he used Rosin-core solder on the contacts and left the old wire in the temp control unit (soldering the Common connection to the new wire). Makes me wonder if we need to swap out the temp unit wire too?
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Post by turbokinetic on Mar 4, 2023 18:01:31 GMT
I'm currently showing the following: White to Green: 4 ohms Black to Green: 23 Ohms Black to White: 20 Ohms Seems like a strange reading. I have this set to the continuity portion of the tester. My friend noted that he used Rosin-core solder on the contacts and left the old wire in the temp control unit (soldering the Common connection to the new wire). Makes me wonder if we need to swap out the temp unit wire too? It's wired wrong at compressor terminals. The highest reading is run to start. Black to green is highest, so that makes white your common. Green is run, and black is start. |
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