|
Post by elec573 on Aug 31, 2018 5:27:43 GMT
Hopefully it’s not a float issue. Chris is very knowledgeable about CAs also.
|
|
|
Post by ajc31980 on Aug 31, 2018 5:34:42 GMT
Hopefully it’s not a float issue. Chris is very knowledgeable about CAs also. I’m hoping the same. But if it is. I’m willing to learn and do a cap conversion. The real trick will be getting the MF I’m hoping that it just still has some none condensables in the system yet.
|
|
|
Post by ajc31980 on Aug 31, 2018 9:42:58 GMT
Some short vids of how it sounds. Please keep in mind that my phone tends to make things sound a good bit louder than they are. The CA doesn’t sound this loud in person. This is what it sounded like when I purged it last weekend. youtu.be/dybaZASEBzEThis one is from tonight after I got home from work around 230am. It had been running for roughly 20 min. Also. It had sat all week turned off but was plugged in for the heater to keep things warmed up. youtu.be/a5RKys7H914This one is after it had been running for close to 3 hours. youtu.be/Bk-WFpNhaxcAt the moment it doesn’t seem to be doing to bad. So I loaded it up with some soda and I’m going let it run until I get up later on today. If it seems ok I plan leaving it run all weekend to see how it does.
|
|
|
Post by elec573 on Aug 31, 2018 18:20:30 GMT
You’re right about the phone making it sound louder. But I’ll let the ca experienced members weigh in and see what they think.
|
|
|
Post by turbokinetic on Aug 31, 2018 18:26:25 GMT
Some short vids of how it sounds. Please keep in mind that my phone tends to make things sound a good bit louder than they are. The CA doesn’t sound this loud in person. ....... At the moment it doesn’t seem to be doing to bad. So I loaded it up with some soda and I’m going let it run until I get up later on today. If it seems ok I plan leaving it run all weekend to see how it does.
Not bad at all! It's very hard to know how loud it is in real life based on a video, due to the volume normalizing function in the camera. But the quality of the sound seems good.
You’re right about the phone making it sound louder. But I’ll let the ca experienced members weigh in and see what they think.
When I edit my videos, the thing always seem louder than they did in real life as well. Hoping to hear from some of the other CA gurus!
|
|
|
Post by ajc31980 on Aug 31, 2018 19:49:54 GMT
Some short vids of how it sounds. Please keep in mind that my phone tends to make things sound a good bit louder than they are. The CA doesn’t sound this loud in person. ....... At the moment it doesn’t seem to be doing to bad. So I loaded it up with some soda and I’m going let it run until I get up later on today. If it seems ok I plan leaving it run all weekend to see how it does.
Not bad at all! It's very hard to know how loud it is in real life based on a video, due to the volume normalizing function in the camera. But the quality of the sound seems good.
You’re right about the phone making it sound louder. But I’ll let the ca experienced members weigh in and see what they think.
When I edit my videos, the thing always seem louder than they did in real life as well. Hoping to hear from some of the other CA gurus!
I think that some times the sound depends on what the video is being played back on. If I play these video clips back on my lap top or stream them to the TV the sound is closer to what it actually sounds like. But when playing them back on my phone they sound a good bit louder than what they actually are.
|
|
|
Post by ajc31980 on Sept 1, 2018 6:25:12 GMT
Hi all The run times haven’t changed. No better, no worse. I decided to give it another purge. It took 4 rounds till I I got MF so it did still have NCG’s in the system. Then let it run for about half hour then cracked the valve and got MF right away. So hopefully I’m done with the purging. The frost line still looks healthy like it did in the video clip I posted last night. However it didn’t help with the run times. So sadly I’m thinking it may have a worn valve seat or possibly a bad check valve ? I’m thinking if it was truly low on MF I wouldn’t be getting a good frost line. I made a quick 2 min video of how fast the evap temp drops and rises. I started the video just before it cycled off. The cabinet temperature is 37/38 F and the temperature control is set at 5. The temperature probe is frozen to the inside center of the evaporator. It seems like the temp starts climbing kinda fast to me. Or maybe this normal ? youtu.be/_LmBDhQnY-U
|
|
|
Post by turbokinetic on Sept 1, 2018 13:25:17 GMT
Hi all The run times haven’t changed. No better, no worse. I decided to give it another purge. It took 4 rounds till I I got MF so it did still have NCG’s in the system. Then let it run for about half hour then cracked the valve and got MF right away. So hopefully I’m done with the purging. The frost line still looks healthy like it did in the video clip I posted last night. However it didn’t help with the run times. So sadly I’m thinking it may have a worn valve seat or possibly a bad check valve ? I’m thinking if it was truly low on MF I wouldn’t be getting a good frost line. I made a quick 2 min video of how fast the evap temp drops and rises. I started the video just before it cycled off. The cabinet temperature is 37/38 F and the temperature control is set at 5. The temperature probe is frozen to the inside center of the evaporator. It seems like the temp starts climbing kinda fast to me. Or maybe this normal ? youtu.be/_LmBDhQnY-U
Hi AJ. I wonder how the insulation condition is in your cabinet?
Also; another question. It cycled off at 8.4°F in the video, and rose to 12°F by the end of the video. Do you know what the cut-in temperature is? I wonder if the control its self could be worn or misadjusted? In other words, the cut-in and cut-out temperatures are too close together? I don't have a CK to compare it to; just tossing out ideas of things that can make any control system cycle too frequently.
I bet the proper cycling temperatures are listed in the manual. EDIT: I found it on page 36 of the manual. The manual state for a CA-1B it should cycle between 10°F and 20°F with control at position 5.
|
|
|
Post by ajc31980 on Sept 1, 2018 16:20:01 GMT
Hi all The run times haven’t changed. No better, no worse. I decided to give it another purge. It took 4 rounds till I I got MF so it did still have NCG’s in the system. Then let it run for about half hour then cracked the valve and got MF right away. So hopefully I’m done with the purging. The frost line still looks healthy like it did in the video clip I posted last night. However it didn’t help with the run times. So sadly I’m thinking it may have a worn valve seat or possibly a bad check valve ? I’m thinking if it was truly low on MF I wouldn’t be getting a good frost line. I made a quick 2 min video of how fast the evap temp drops and rises. I started the video just before it cycled off. The cabinet temperature is 37/38 F and the temperature control is set at 5. The temperature probe is frozen to the inside center of the evaporator. It seems like the temp starts climbing kinda fast to me. Or maybe this normal ? youtu.be/_LmBDhQnY-U
Hi AJ. I wonder how the insulation condition is in your cabinet?
Also; another question. It cycled off at 8.4°F in the video, and rose to 12°F by the end of the video. Do you know what the cut-in temperature is? I wonder if the control its self could be worn or misadjusted? In other words, the cut-in and cut-out temperatures are too close together? I don't have a CK to compare it to; just tossing out ideas of things that can make any control system cycle too frequently.
I bet the proper cycling temperatures are listed in the manual. EDIT: I found it on page 36 of the manual. The manual state for a CA-1B it should cycle between 10°F and 20°F with control at position 5.
Hi David I did download and print the manual. I’ve read through it a few times 🙂 I cut the video when it hit 12F degrees. It doesn’t kick back on until it hits 20/21F. Sorry if it was mis leading . I just wanted to show how fast the evap temp started to climb after it shuts off. The box temp only raises 2 or 3 degrees between cycles. Right now The on time is 3:45 min and the off time is 5:50 min. Yesterday before I did a purge it was 5:26 on 5:34 off. So it did improve some since the last purge. I really don’t think there much NCGs left to purge. I want to let it run for another full day before or 2 before cracking the valve again. It also sounds pretty quiet when running. The insulation seems ok. From what I could see by removing the the black covers around the door opening all of the cardboard looks new . The top gasket is in good shape too. It’s soft and seems to make a good seal. ( I think the top gasket may have been replaced at some point ) The outside of the cabinet stays room temp. If I check it right now the cabinet out side temp is 72 Same as the room temp. Same with the door. I did re-insulate the door the with r-13 pink fiberglass. It’s packed good and solid. From what I can tell the top insulation seems to be ok too. I had the heater plug out and felt around with my finger. It feels dry in that area. Also I don’t think it’s a check valve issue. I was thinking that maybe that was a possibility. The suction line stays cold after the compressor shuts off and there’s no hissing sound. So that’s pointing me back to a possible float issue. Edit I forgot to mention that the box temp is 32F today. Thanks. AJ
|
|
|
Post by ajc31980 on Sept 1, 2018 16:47:55 GMT
Oh I for got to mention. The evaporator did not defrost with a pan of hot water sitting in it. I forget what thread I read that in or why that’s a good thing. I swear I’ve spent way to much time reading threads on here lol.
|
|
|
Post by cablehack on Sept 1, 2018 23:52:26 GMT
It sounds just like a CA should. The frost line looks high enough, so it's not short of methyl formate. The first thing to find out is what the evaporator temperature can actually get down to. That is, if the compressor is left running continuously. At this point I wouldn't be taking too much notice of what the control setting is because that can drift. Also, I wouldn't be too concerned about what the cabinet temperature is yet, because that depends on other variables. According to the specifications for the CA-1 form B, the evaporator should get down to at least 0 degrees F. Unless this can be achieved, the cooling capacity will never be enough to give very long off times. A cold low side tube indicates the check valve is OK, so the other (and likely) cause of poor cycling times is a worn needle and seat.
|
|
|
Post by ajc31980 on Sept 2, 2018 2:09:25 GMT
It sounds just like a CA should. The frost line looks high enough, so it's not short of methyl formate. The first thing to find out is what the evaporator temperature can actually get down to. That is, if the compressor is left running continuously. At this point I wouldn't be taking too much notice of what the control setting is because that can drift. Also, I wouldn't be too concerned about what the cabinet temperature is yet, because that depends on other variables. According to the specifications for the CA-1 form B, the evaporator should get down to at least 0 degrees F. Unless this can be achieved, the cooling capacity will never be enough to give very long off times. A cold low side tube indicates the check valve is OK, so the other (and likely) cause of poor cycling times is a worn needle and seat. Hi cablehack Thank you for all of that information. I did see that the evaporator should be able to get down to zero in the service manual. I think lowest I’ve seen it get down to is 6F. And it had to run for very long time to get that low. I’ll try turning it up 9 and see if it ever gets down to 0F. Thank you for confirming that the check valve is ok. I’ve been reading a good bit. And I’m sadly thinking along the lines of the float having issues too. But if it does. Then I get to learn how to fix it . I’m staying positive about this. I read up on the CAs and knew what I was possibly singing up for when I got this one. Just something about the CAs that really caught my eye. And kinda like to have a DR someday to but that’s way off. I don’t have the room lol
|
|
|
Post by ajc31980 on Sept 2, 2018 6:46:04 GMT
After running none stop for about an hour and a half. It finally got down to 0F. This is my temp reading. . This is as low as it will go.
|
|
|
Post by turbokinetic on Sept 2, 2018 13:11:01 GMT
Hi David I did download and print the manual. I’ve read through it a few times 🙂 I cut the video when it hit 12F degrees. It doesn’t kick back on until it hits 20/21F. Sorry if it was mis leading . I just wanted to show how fast the evap temp started to climb after it shuts off. The box temp only raises 2 or 3 degrees between cycles. Right now The on time is 3:45 min and the off time is 5:50 min. Yesterday before I did a purge it was 5:26 on 5:34 off. So it did improve some since the last purge. I really don’t think there much NCGs left to purge. I want to let it run for another full day before or 2 before cracking the valve again. It also sounds pretty quiet when running. The insulation seems ok. From what I could see by removing the the black covers around the door opening all of the cardboard looks new . The top gasket is in good shape too. It’s soft and seems to make a good seal. ( I think the top gasket may have been replaced at some point ) The outside of the cabinet stays room temp. If I check it right now the cabinet out side temp is 72 Same as the room temp. Same with the door. I did re-insulate the door the with r-13 pink fiberglass. It’s packed good and solid. From what I can tell the top insulation seems to be ok too. I had the heater plug out and felt around with my finger. It feels dry in that area. Also I don’t think it’s a check valve issue. I was thinking that maybe that was a possibility. The suction line stays cold after the compressor shuts off and there’s no hissing sound. So that’s pointing me back to a possible float issue. Edit I forgot to mention that the box temp is 32F today. Thanks. AJ It does seem that the NCG purge helped with the cooling capacity, getting it down to temperature a lot more rapidly.
It seems there's a lot of differing opinions about the insulation in these. When the time comes to work on my DR it will be interesting to see how awful the insulation in that one is. Doing some research on that, I found pictures where the cardboard seems to rot in patchy areas. It seems that many of them are so-so around the door, but towards the back and bottom it's basically gone.
In my experimentation, it seems that air leaking in around the top is a lot more serious of a problem than the side panel insulation. When tinkering with these units, it made a noticeable cycle time improvement to put tape around the top-to-cabinet area. That indicates there would be air leaking in. That would, of course, hit directly on the evaporator as it filtered in at the top.
In your video, I couldn't hear the unit re-start at the end, so wasn't sure if it had kicked back in or not. Thanks for clarifying that!
Cablehack has a lot of experience with these machines. I will be interested to see what you guys settle on as a root cause!
|
|
|
Post by ajc31980 on Sept 3, 2018 0:35:34 GMT
Hi David I did download and print the manual. I’ve read through it a few times 🙂 I cut the video when it hit 12F degrees. It doesn’t kick back on until it hits 20/21F. Sorry if it was mis leading . I just wanted to show how fast the evap temp started to climb after it shuts off. The box temp only raises 2 or 3 degrees between cycles. Right now The on time is 3:45 min and the off time is 5:50 min. Yesterday before I did a purge it was 5:26 on 5:34 off. So it did improve some since the last purge. I really don’t think there much NCGs left to purge. I want to let it run for another full day before or 2 before cracking the valve again. It also sounds pretty quiet when running. The insulation seems ok. From what I could see by removing the the black covers around the door opening all of the cardboard looks new . The top gasket is in good shape too. It’s soft and seems to make a good seal. ( I think the top gasket may have been replaced at some point ) The outside of the cabinet stays room temp. If I check it right now the cabinet out side temp is 72 Same as the room temp. Same with the door. I did re-insulate the door the with r-13 pink fiberglass. It’s packed good and solid. From what I can tell the top insulation seems to be ok too. I had the heater plug out and felt around with my finger. It feels dry in that area. Also I don’t think it’s a check valve issue. I was thinking that maybe that was a possibility. The suction line stays cold after the compressor shuts off and there’s no hissing sound. So that’s pointing me back to a possible float issue. Edit I forgot to mention that the box temp is 32F today. Thanks. AJ It does seem that the NCG purge helped with the cooling capacity, getting it down to temperature a lot more rapidly.
It seems there's a lot of differing opinions about the insulation in these. When the time comes to work on my DR it will be interesting to see how awful the insulation in that one is. Doing some research on that, I found pictures where the cardboard seems to rot in patchy areas. It seems that many of them are so-so around the door, but towards the back and bottom it's basically gone.
In my experimentation, it seems that air leaking in around the top is a lot more serious of a problem than the side panel insulation. When tinkering with these units, it made a noticeable cycle time improvement to put tape around the top-to-cabinet area. That indicates there would be air leaking in. That would, of course, hit directly on the evaporator as it filtered in at the top.
In your video, I couldn't hear the unit re-start at the end, so wasn't sure if it had kicked back in or not. Thanks for clarifying that!
Cablehack has a lot of experience with these machines. I will be interested to see what you guys settle on as a root cause!
I had one of my friends come over and help me take the top off today. Here’s a pic of the gasket that was on it. ( and it’s before it was cleaned up ). There Was a gap back by the evap. I’m thinking this wasn’t the original gasket. I replaced it with the same gasket I used on the door. (I had extra leftover) I had to make 2 layers. Figured it worth a shot to see how works.
|
|