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Post by coldspaces on Jan 15, 2017 3:26:47 GMT
Thursday I plugged in the oil heater and started the vacuum pump on this unit, letting it run most of the day. At the end I tripped the unit so the float would open to be sure the low side had evacuated fully. I kept the discharge line up so oil would stay out of the condenser coil. The garage was in the 30s to start with and the heat was only on part of the day. That night I charged in most of 20 oz of 152a to start with and turned her on. At first it tried to cool but I could not get the float to stay open and make the gas circulate it seemed. I think things might have been oil logged but not sure. I added 10 more oz and still nothing till I opened the float manually. With the float forced open I had plenty of flow and it was frosting the coil but if I closed the float it would not open on its own. The whole time there was a bit of rattle probably from putting in so much liquid fast through the high side that it was in the cold oil and the heater did not have time to boil it all out. At this point I decided to add one more 10 oz can. Well it still didn't want to open the float and it was a lot noisier than before I added the last can. I ran it like this for enough time that the compressor seemed to be warmed up and and I though the refrigerant should have left the oil but the float still would not cooperate. Manually opening of float worked great so I knew the float was not plugged shut. Finally I got tired of the noise and decided its late and time to let the heater work all night even though the garage was cold. Friday morning I tried it again and had the same noise and no float unless I forced it open. I let it run for some time with float open and it all warmed up good but the rattle was still pretty bad and the float would not open on its own. At this point I was starting to think the 152a did not have the liquid density to open the float. I had to shut it down and go to work. Late that after noon I tried it again and there was no rattle at all and to my surprise the float started to work on its own. I can only think that either the evap. was oil logged some still or the oil finally got warm enough to free up enough refrigerant to make the liquid needed to open the float. Could also be that the float was plain sticking someway. The garage was pretty cold all that day so I would have thought the oil might still be pretty cold also and expected it to still rattle. During all this I had taken the control sensor lose so it would run non stop. After running about 1 3/4 hours straight I took these pics. Garage was 60-65 f at the time. Watts were real close to what it should be at 80 F so it looks promising. I have since hooked the control bulb back to the coil and it will set and cycle nicely in the 60 F ambient, it is setting in the open air and not on a cabinet. Watts are about 220 at start up and drop to about 190 or below when it cycles off. I have started it several more times from a 40 ish ambient with no rattle and float works right off, of course I have left the heater on the whole time. I never seen an Evap like that on any D series. It looks like a CK evap? Its just like my 32 with 134a in it. Has the s. steel evap. must have been factory rebuilds. |
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andy
New Member
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Post by andy on Jan 15, 2017 22:08:46 GMT
The modern dehumidifier I filled with R152a over a year ago is still working fine. I didn't even bother finding duster without the bitterant.
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Post by coldspaces on Jan 15, 2017 23:00:44 GMT
I got it on a cabinet today and have some run times. This is in a 65 F ambient, the units has only been on the box a few hours although the box was already somewhat cool inside as the garage is not heated 24/7. The times below were after only an hour to acclimate.
On at 3:50:55
Hi press PSIG 55
Box temp. 36
Watts just after start up 233
Off at 3:52:20
Hi press PSIG 66
Box temp. 34
Watts at shut down 206
On at 4:07:20
Hi press PSIG 54
Box temp 36
Watts just after start up 236
Off at 4:09:46
Hi press PSIG 66
Box temp. 33
Watts at shut down 205
On at 4:24:43
Hi press PSIG 55
Box temp 36
Watts just after start up 233
Off at 4:26:56
Hi press PSIG 66
Box temp. 33
Watts at shut down 207
On at 4:42:05
Hi press PSIG 55
Box temp 36
Watts just after start up 234
Off at 4:44:26
Hi press PSIG 66
Box temp. 33
Watts at shut down 207
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Post by Travis on Jan 15, 2017 23:11:06 GMT
That looks promising.
I spoke to Hank in PA, Lou and emailed Garrett. I am still in shock that you can buy refrigerant from the office supply store.
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Post by coldspaces on Jan 15, 2017 23:13:17 GMT
That looks promising. I spoke to Hank in PA, Lou and emailed Garrett. I am still in shock that you can buy refrigerant from the office supply store. I sure wasn't planning to find a potential SO2 replacement there. |
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Post by 100yearfridge on Jan 16, 2017 1:37:18 GMT
Nice work on the can adapter!
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Post by Travis on Jan 16, 2017 3:09:34 GMT
I used to use that to blow out random hairs and dirt out of 35mm projectors at work. Little did I know that I was holding monitor top refrigerant at the time.
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Post by coldspaces on Jan 16, 2017 4:26:37 GMT
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Post by elec573 on Jan 16, 2017 4:56:55 GMT
Very nice work thanks for posting!
Run times look good my ck with new insultion is 2min 4 sec on and off Seamed to vary from 16 to14 mins @ approximately 33 dregrees cabinet temp . Well be interesting to see how this proforms over a longer time span! Thanks again for posting!
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Post by coldspaces on Jan 16, 2017 5:25:11 GMT
Crazy thing about all this is it was looking like there was nothing this close, at least until more gases became available here. Then I found I already owned some and its everywhere.
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Post by ckfan on Jan 16, 2017 16:53:41 GMT
I'm so happy that something so commonplace could work with these old SO2 machines. Good work Gill.
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Post by coldspaces on Jan 16, 2017 17:50:07 GMT
I'm so happy that something so commonplace could work with these old SO2 machines. Good work Gill. Watts are higher and we have yet to see what happens in higher ambient but it sure looks promising. |
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Post by ckfan on Jan 16, 2017 20:41:18 GMT
Oh, trust me. I know you are a long way from "calling it". There are issues that could rise up. It just blows me away that something that is so easy to grab off the shelf MIGHT be the replacement we have all been looking for. I hope it works great in higher ambient temperature and isn't harsh on the windings and is great for oil return. I guess we won't really know until this brave little DR has a lot more hours under its belt.
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Post by coldspaces on Jan 21, 2017 4:49:04 GMT
Well a lot has happened in the last 5-6 days and I am sorry I didn't find time to keep you all up to date. Monday I added another 10 oz can of refrigerant. I warmed the can and forced it in as a liquid again. The compressor didn't like it this time either as it was back to rattling some once more, it stopped though after it cycled a while. It is not being helped by the normally cold garage, just gets into the cold oil to easy, low side dome units would not have this happen so easy when charging through the high side valve. Anyway the extra gas gave higher frost lines and the cycle times were better. It was running only about 1&1/2 minutes and off about 20. The next 24 hours it ran pretty good and the frost line looked good still. The cycle times were about the same the next night, until I decided to try it at a higher ambient and did this.  The poor thing was running in the cold garage and I warmed the air from 40s to 65 at first and it was working ok still. Then I enclosed the thing in my custom test cell and added a heater. After about 1/2 hour I took this pic when it was 95 F in the test cell. By now the unit was rattling again as if liquid refrigerant was in the oil. After that it got to 100 F in the box and I let the thing rattle along for 1&1/2 hours more. Near the end of that time it somewhat suddenly showed signs of no longer opening the float at all. I let it run for over 12 minutes while the watts were down to 130ish and nothing was going thought the float. The evap was defrosting by then. My first thought was it got to hot to condense enough liquid to open the float. At this point it was late so I shut it off and I gave up for the night. The next day I realized its a high pressure dome on this poor Ginny pig, I had forced the ambient up way to fast when the oil was still quite cold. I had effectively caused the refrigerant charge to condense in the crankcase is why there was no liquid to open the float. The next day and 1/2 it was left to run and tried to work but rattled all the time I was near it and just didn't want to open the float all the time. I tried to get it to cooperate by forcing the float open for a while several times but it just would not get back to flowing right. Final last night I decide to shut it down and let the heater do its thing. This morning I tried it again and it still didn't want to do right so I shut it down. By late afternoon the heater and warmer temps outdoors liberated enough refrigerant that it finally started to work again. It was still rattling most of the cycle but I left it on and tonight it finally is back to working good and no rattle. The most interesting part of this whole thing was even when the temp was way up the watts stayed about the same, on at 230ish and off at 200ish, even when I had the high pressure up to 103 psig at the end. The watts it seemed were dependent of what made it through the float more than the pressure on the high side. Overall it think this may work pretty good but it may need more watts in the crank case heater, especially if used in a cold area. |
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Post by coldspaces on Jan 25, 2017 1:28:54 GMT
Now that this machine has settled back in it has run times of about 1 min 10 sec in a 60f garage and stays off for almost 20 mins. It still rattles at times if the oil is cold. I also ran across an article from 152a's earlier days that tells that a mix of 80% 152a and 20% Novec 1230 is non flammable. Looks like the Novec 1230 will not be easy to get to see if the mix works in a so2 refrigerator. www.ijmerr.com/v3n3/ijmerr_v3n3_3.pdf |
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