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Post by turbokinetic on Oct 22, 2018 3:02:46 GMT
Working on Travis's 1930 Westinghouse. It's a sick puppy. 
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Post by coldspaces on Oct 22, 2018 5:27:03 GMT
Great work as usual!
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Post by Travis on Oct 22, 2018 7:37:23 GMT
It's neat to see it open. You must have a Westinghouse opening tool, lol. I didn't expect it to be fixable, so no tears.
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Post by turbokinetic on Oct 22, 2018 13:15:34 GMT
Thanks! It's neat to see it open. You must have a Westinghouse opening tool, lol. I didn't expect it to be fixable, so no tears.
Yeah, I didn't hold high hopes for it, but you never know until you try! It was interesting none the less. And yes, I do have a Westinghouse opening tool. This can be purchased here: www.grainger.com/product/53DT13
Adapters for GE and Frigidaire are available separately, as well: www.grainger.com/product/25TY43
After talking to you about the used Westinghouse compressor (the one that's out of the system) I believe its system was suffering from moisture blocking its cap tube. It should be fine with a dryer. The only issue will be connecting new lines to it where they are mangled off short at the side of the unit.
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Post by jake on Oct 22, 2018 16:39:20 GMT
Thanks for sharing another great video!! It's ashame the compressor is beyond repair. But at least you know why it failed and we got an interesting view of the inner workings of it!! Do you think that if the people had kept using it instead of putting it in storage this would not have happened? Or is this type of deterioration inevitable?
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Post by Travis on Oct 22, 2018 17:03:59 GMT
Jake,
The past history of this unit is cloudy. I bought it from a lady who said it came from her husbands family. The compressor area had been lined with pieces of ceiling tile and the cord was newer. I don't recall anyone making a claim that it ever worked. The house was around 20 yrs old at best. In my opinion, this was a someday project of her husband or a decorative item.
Am I correct that there's an actual splice going to the unloader? If so, no junction is forever. As much as we appreciate this stuff, we do have to respect that everything is designed for a certain lifespan. I don't know how many years they intended, but we have to assume it wasn't 50+.
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Post by birkie on Oct 22, 2018 18:11:17 GMT
Thanks for the video. It is fascinating to see the insides of another kind of SO2 compressor.
A few questions:
- what made you conclude that the issue was not in the terminals, and therefore proceed to cutting open the conoressor)?
- having seen the compressor terminals from behind, what conclusions do you draw about their repairability, or approaches to repairing them?
- have you tried extracting the piston from the bore with more force?
- is there any evidence of carbon deposits on the high side?
From the video, the windings look a lot like DR windings. It's kind of a miracle that windings in that condition can function. I know other DRs with stuck pistons have had to be whacked with a hammer and wooden block to break free, and I believe the culpret had been carbon deposits. It would be interesting to see if it was carbon in this case, or corrosion.
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Post by turbokinetic on Oct 22, 2018 23:09:08 GMT
Thanks for sharing another great video!! It's ashame the compressor is beyond repair. But at least you know why it failed and we got an interesting view of the inner workings of it!! Do you think that if the people had kept using it instead of putting it in storage this would not have happened? Or is this type of deterioration inevitable? Hi Jake. I'm not an expert enough to say for sure it's inevitable. We know that the GE units such as the CK don't tend to fail in this manner. I have a feeling that the Westinghouse had a prolonged, slow leak on the low side. This let it draw in moisture and water over the years. Also, I have found out that the float system is either blocked or broken, causing the system to be obstructed. The compressor was probably run against a severe high discharge pressure situation for a long time.
I'm currently swapping evaporators between the failed SO2 unit, and the black R12 unit. That will be the most effective path forward to get this little Westy back in business! One of the most special parts of it is the clockwork control. This I will be keeping and adapting to the new unit.
Jake, The past history of this unit is cloudy. I bought it from a lady who said it came from her husbands family. The compressor area had been lined with pieces of ceiling tile and the cord was newer. I don't recall anyone making a claim that it ever worked. The house was around 20 yrs old at best. In my opinion, this was a someday project of her husband or a decorative item. Am I correct that there's an actual splice going to the unloader? If so, no junction is forever. As much as we appreciate this stuff, we do have to respect that everything is designed for a certain lifespan. I don't know how many years they intended, but we have to assume it wasn't 50+. Yes; I got confused after talking with you and Ray for a couple days. Mixed up the story in my video! There is actually a splice in the unloader wires. They were twisted, soldered, and then taped over with what appears to be electrical tape (!) inside the compressor. Thanks for the video. It is fascinating to see the insides of another kind of SO2 compressor. A few questions: - what made you conclude that the issue was not in the terminals, and therefore proceed to cutting open the conoressor)? - having seen the compressor terminals from behind, what conclusions do you draw about their repairability, or approaches to repairing them? - have you tried extracting the piston from the bore with more force? - is there any evidence of carbon deposits on the high side? From the video, the windings look a lot like DR windings. It's kind of a miracle that windings in that condition can function. I know other DRs with stuck pistons have had to be whacked with a hammer and wooden block to break free, and I believe the culpret had been carbon deposits. It would be interesting to see if it was carbon in this case, or corrosion.
Hi Aaron. Yep it's very interesting to see how these are made!
I'll answer point by point:
As for the terminals, I was able to free them up from the housing so that nothing was touching. The extremely low resistance to earth went away, however there was still some continuity to the shell (in the 100's of ohms). So, the terminals were an issue but not the only issue.
The back part of the compressor terminals is made of the same composite material which became conductive. Unless this is completely prevented from touching the case of the compressor, resistive shorts will persist.
I had to return the rental truck, and get my car out of hock from the BHM airport parking deck today. Been home just about an hour or two. Spending time on the hopefully useful parts to get the fridge working, but have not tried to force the piston out of the cylinder.
There are carbon deposits everywhere. The whole thing is hideous. The SO2 smell dissipated over night, but the whole shop smells like burning funk. I put the parts of the compressor outside.
Interestingly, this compressor appears designed to be rebuildable. The end dome has a long machined surface where it "plugs" the end of the compressor case. The weld could be cut off and rewelded multiple times before there's not enough material remaining. Furthermore, the tight fit design prevents grinding dust or weld spatter from going into the compressor. If I had a big enough lathe, the whole compressor could be "turned" and "faced off" to remove the weld. Then it would only take away about 1/8" of the case to weld back together. All the part inside have slotted head screws to assemble it.
As said I'm working on getting together a running unit for this fridge. Then may play with the scrap iron some more LOL!
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Post by turbokinetic on Oct 23, 2018 3:11:38 GMT
So, I got a little update today!
I had obligations for the first half the day, but tried to move forward on the Westy after I got home.
The deck had to come out, and during this work, I found this! Not good and could have contributed to the demise of the system. .jpg)
After removing the ruins of the compressor, I discovered the float was broken or plugged. Let it sit with solvent in it over night, and today still no dice. It sounds like the float is detached or broken. Tomorrow I will make a video of cutting open the float chamber to see what's up.
They used a lot of very substantial hardwood in the cabinet. No wonder it is so heavy! .jpg)
The faulty float caused me to change plans from using the "loose" compressor as a replacement for the failed one, keeping the original deck. That left the only option to be the other complete unit. The reason we didn't want that originally is because it does not look the part. It's a cap tube system. Although that is good from a functionality standpoint, the look of the 1930 Westinghouse has the float chamber and prominent service port cap up top. But, that is all for naught since it's broken.
The spare unit was "almost" the same, however its evaporator is taller, and the wood post which supports the evaporator is also longer. I set it on the cabinet, and the evaporator set against the top shelf in the fridge. No bueno.
So, I started to deconstruct the original deck, wood post, and evaporator. The float chamber was sitting in a mount that had been filled with tar. This was covering the bolts holding the wood post in. I had to dig through that with great difficulty. Finally, I got the post out. Then it was more tar and funk to get the remains of the tubing out of the post's inner bore.
I flushed the evaporator with brake cleaner and got out a small amount of debris, but nothing horrible. There was not much oil in there, surprisingly.
Then, the donor unit got deconstructed. I saved the lines on this unit, being careful not to damage the capillary tube. The lines were longer since the original wood post was longer. That helped with the hookup of the smaller evaporator.
Since there is no float chamber with service port, I was left with no choice but to put in a SAE 1/4" flare Schrader port. The compressor motor has a crimped and brazed fitting on the end of it, for the low-side of the system. I put a stem and port there for charging.
Pulled vacuum and then drew in an equal amount of oil as to what I found in the original larger evaporator from the donor unit. Then, gave it a one hour evac while heating the new evaporator with heat gun to drive out any moisture or brake cleaner.
Finally, gave it some refrigerant vapor through the new service port, and fired up the compressor! It took one 10 oz can of R152A to be fully frosted.
.jpg)
Nice and cold! .jpg)
You can get an idea of the size difference between the original evaporator from the donor unit, and the one from the 1930 Westinghouse. The one in my hand came from a large 2-door model. .jpg)
The top of the cabinet must have also been thicker, because the wood post was also longer. This made the change-over a lot more time consuming! .jpg)
So, tomorrow the original 1930 fan motor goes in. The one in the unit now is ugly, plus it's stiff and slow and oiling didn't help it.
Also, the fancy 1930 clockwork control will go in as well, so the fridge will look as close to original as possible, save for the float chamber missing.
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Post by elec573 on Oct 23, 2018 4:26:44 GMT
Very interesting sense I have a westy that has the same problem with the terminals. So you’re thinking is , it’s the unloader wires shorting together?
Not the terminals shorted to ground?
Mine also has so2 in it .
Thanks for the look inside , have been wondering about what those terminals look like on the inside.
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Post by Travis on Oct 23, 2018 16:47:11 GMT
Herb,
I think what David is saying is that the unloader wires grounded on that particular unit. I don't think you can draw the same conclusion yet about your unit. I think WH failures are similar, but maybe not as predictable as the MT's.
The video does show us the internals of the unit. I suspect that you'd have to evacuate your unit and disassemble your terminals to learn why it failed. You likely would have to open it.
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Post by turbokinetic on Oct 24, 2018 2:37:17 GMT
Herb, I think what David is saying is that the unloader wires grounded on that particular unit. I don't think you can draw the same conclusion yet about your unit. I think WH failures are similar, but maybe not as predictable as the MT's. The video does show us the internals of the unit. I suspect that you'd have to evacuate your unit and disassemble your terminals to learn why it failed. You likely would have to open it. Yes, basically this. The terminals were definitely grounded, severely. Once I eliminated them as a possible ground, the fault went from just about one ohm to a few hundred ohms. Because it wasn't completely clear, I didn't proceed trying to repair the terminals. Also with two spare compressors on hand, it didn't seem like the best path forward to repair it.
Here is a close-up of the burned and shorted seal bushing. .JPG)
I cleaned up the machinery compartment on the cabinet, so the new cooling unit would have a nice home. .JPG)
I took all the external parts off the cooling unit which was headed for scrap. This came from one of the two-door Westinghouse fridges at The Magic Chef Mansion. It was replaced because it was running all the time. I don't know what was wrong with it at that time, but currently the compressor is very healthy. .JPG)
The area where I connected the original lines from the new compressor to the evaporator transplanted from the old unit. Painted it silver so it would not look like a botch job. .JPG)
Test fit of the basic cooling unit. .JPG)
Getting some wiring in place... .JPG)
Now, the re-lubricated and cleaned fan motor is in place. .JPG)
Close up view of the evaporator in place. Again; this is the original evaporator from the old SO2 unit, installed on the newer R12 unit in place of its larger evaporator. .JPG)
Close up of the intricate clockwork control. .JPG)
And, a video!
Here are some carnage pictures of the old compressor...
The piston is locked up in the cylinder, and there is SEVERE corrosive attack and carbon sludge in the compressor. It's almost like it was on fire inside. .JPG)
.JPG)
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Post by elec573 on Oct 24, 2018 4:14:37 GMT
Nice job . It looks like new . Thanks for the look inside I see these Westinghouse fridges quite often on eBay and craglist. Maybe we can start rescuing some of them .
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Post by turbokinetic on Oct 24, 2018 14:05:41 GMT
Nice job . It looks like new . Thanks for the look inside I see these Westinghouse fridges quite often on eBay and craglist. Maybe we can start rescuing some of them .
Thanks! As for rescuing them, there is one more compressor here. It's good I believe; and was an R12 unit so not going to be all corroded inside.
Both the compressors were doomed to the scrapyard so it was a great save.
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Post by elec573 on Oct 25, 2018 5:40:17 GMT
So do you think the ones with so2 are non repairable? Or just more problems than they are worth !
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