|
|
Post by dcraven on May 16, 2018 19:52:07 GMT
This 1950's GE fridge I installed new wiring, insulation, paint, R041 start relay. Originally when I got it, it was ran and cooled as well as to be expected considering the non-existant door seal. After disassembly, rewiring it, installing new insulation and then reassembly it still worked and got a good frost pattern on the evaporator. Now after moving it from one house to another the compressor kicks on and runs very quietly as before (my last 50's GE with a leak sounded like a freight train due to lack of oil). You can hear and feel the coolant running thru the evaporator, yet there's no frost pattern and the evaporator no longer even feels cool at all. I'm not certified but I have my own equipment to pressurize with nitrogen, and know how to repair leaks and charge modern 134a fridges. I feel lost on this one though as I don't know where to install a tap, or what's the high side and low side? Is it possible to do it without installing a tap? I do see that R12 is available online via ebay |
|
|
|
Post by turbokinetic on May 16, 2018 22:30:49 GMT
This 1950's GE fridge I installed new wiring, insulation, paint, R041 start relay. Originally when I got it, it was ran and cooled as well as to be expected considering the non-existant door seal. After disassembly, rewiring it, installing new insulation and then reassembly it still worked and got a good frost pattern on the evaporator. Now after moving it from one house to another the compressor kicks on and runs very quietly as before (my last 50's GE with a leak sounded like a freight train due to lack of oil). You can hear and feel the coolant running thru the evaporator, yet there's no frost pattern and the evaporator no longer even feels cool at all. I'm not certified but I have my own equipment to pressurize with nitrogen, and know how to repair leaks and charge modern 134a fridges. I feel lost on this one though as I don't know where to install a tap, or what's the high side and low side? Is it possible to do it without installing a tap? I do see that R12 is available online via ebay
Hi and welcome! I'm fairly new to the forum myself but figure I'll make a reply and hope the experienced guys add to it!
Love the blue color of your fridge!
As for the cooling problem... In your narrative of how the problem developed, I see that it happened suddenly after moving the refrigerator around. These units (I believe) have a float valve metering device. There should be a chamber somewhere in the top area of the fridge where the liquid refrigerant collects, and then lifts a float ball. Once this happens, the float valve needle lifts off the seat and allows liquid refrigerant to flow into the low side of the system. During the time before the float is open, the compressor is building up high pressure in the high side, and pulling the low side pressure down.
If the float valve is permanently open, the refrigerant will flow too easily from the high to low side. This will prevent the high side from building up enough pressure to cause condensation of the gas; as well as prevent the low side from pulling down into a low enough pressure to boil off the liquid.
Since this happened after moving the unit, I would try rocking the fridge and bumping it a few times from different angles. This could dislodge or re-seat the float and allow it to function again. Hopefully the more experienced people will chime in with firsthand experience at this problem and how they solved it.
Sincerely, David
|
|
|
|
Post by ckfan on May 17, 2018 0:39:02 GMT
This fridge doesn’t have a float valve. It has a capillary tube just like a modern unit. If you can hear refrigerant moving around that tells me that it might not be a leak. These units were pretty robust from everything I’ve heard. I’m not sure what could be causing this. I’ll let the experts chime in.
|
|
|
|
Post by turbokinetic on May 17, 2018 0:43:05 GMT
This fridge doesn’t have a float valve. It has a capillary tube just like a modern unit. If you can hear refrigerant moving around that tells me that it might not be a leak. These units were pretty robust from everything I’ve heard. I’m not sure what could be causing this. I’ll let the experts chime in.
When moved, I wonder if it was laid down on its side? I wonder if oil could have migrated somewhere? Also I wonder if debris could have blocked something in the compressor and caused it to pump but pump slowly?
|
|
|
|
Post by jake on May 17, 2018 3:58:56 GMT
Welcome and you have a nice fridge there!! I'm curious about the move. I'm assuming that you used a hand truck. Did you truck it from the side, back, or front? It should have been trucked from the side only. Was it necessary to tilt the fridge forward at any time? The compressor sits very close to the floor. On some GE and Hotpoint models tilting the fridge forward can force the compressor upwards more than it's designed to go. This can put undo stress on the tubing that attaches to the compressor. I didn't see any obvious damage in your photos. Carefully check the tubing near the compressor for oily spots. That's a sign of leakage. How does the condenser feel after the fridge has been running awhile? Say 30 minutes or so. Is it cool/cold? Fully warm? Partially warm? Hot? Partially Hot? During a warm cabinet pull down the condenser will often be warm enough to be uncomfortable to the touch. Not hot enough for a burned hand or anything. It should also be uniformly hot/warm. If air has been pulled into the system due to a leak it will often migrate to the condenser. This can cause a partially warm condenser. You can also try putting a pan of hot water in the freezer with the fridge running. If there's a blockage the increased refrigerant pressure, caused by the hot water pan in the freezer, will sometimes free the blockage. Hope that helps!!
|
|
|
|
Post by dcraven on May 17, 2018 13:19:41 GMT
Thank you everyone for the responses and suggestions. I'll try the the hot water in the freezer and see if that helps, and feel the compressor and condenser to see how warm they get. I wondered if there could be some sort of blockage since looking at the lines I didn't see any oil or cracks but the only resolution I could think of was vacuuming the system and then recharging it. When I moved the fridge I laid it down on the left side. I'd moved it like that several times before without an issue but it only takes once. Here is what the fridge looked like when I first brought it home, as well as a current picture of the inside. The first picture you can also see a GE combo fridge I ended up trading to a friend who does HVAC work. He found a break in the capillary tube and has since fixed that one.    |
|
|
|
Post by turbokinetic on May 17, 2018 20:15:20 GMT
Thank you everyone for the responses and suggestions. I'll try the the hot water in the freezer and see if that helps, and feel the compressor and condenser to see how warm they get. I wondered if there could be some sort of blockage since looking at the lines I didn't see any oil or cracks but the only resolution I could think of was vacuuming the system and then recharging it. When I moved the fridge I laid it down on the left side. I'd moved it like that several times before without an issue but it only takes once. Here is what the fridge looked like when I first brought it home, as well as a current picture of the inside. The first picture you can also see a GE combo fridge I ended up trading to a friend who does HVAC work. He found a break in the capillary tube and has since fixed that one.
If a large slug of oil went through the condenser, it could take some time for this to move through the capillary tube and restore normal operation. Hopefully this or something else simple is at the root of this problem.
By the way, your cosmetic transformation is quite impressive!
|
|
|
|
Post by dcraven on May 17, 2018 20:28:31 GMT
If a large slug of oil went through the condenser, it could take some time for this to move through the capillary tube and restore normal operation. Hopefully this or something else simple is at the root of this problem.
By the way, your cosmetic transformation is quite impressive!
Thanks! Would the pan of hot water placed in the evaporator and letting it run help with that? I've probably haven't let it run longer than 30 minutes as before it would immediately begin cooling. Is there a point at which allowing it to run would damage the compressor? BTW, I just found your youtube videos today, thank you so much for documenting and putting them out there!!! www.youtube.com/watch?v=GBZ6gLzAYB0 |
|
|
|
Post by turbokinetic on May 17, 2018 20:32:18 GMT
If a large slug of oil went through the condenser, it could take some time for this to move through the capillary tube and restore normal operation. Hopefully this or something else simple is at the root of this problem.
By the way, your cosmetic transformation is quite impressive!
Thanks! Would the pan of hot water placed in the evaporator and letting it run help with that? I've probably haven't let it run longer than 30 minutes as before it would immediately begin cooling. Is there a point at which allowing it to run would damage the compressor? BTW, I just found your youtube videos today, thank you so much for documenting and putting them out there!!! www.youtube.com/watch?v=GBZ6gLzAYB0I would say that 30 minutes should not hurt the compressor, as long as it's not drawing excess power. I would just run it 5 minutes at a time with some rest periods in between. It may be that the start / stop cycles are helpful for the compressor if there's something inside stuck or plugged.
Again thanks for watching my videos! Very happy you find them helpful. I enjoy this type of tinkering and problem solving as well!
|
|
|
|
Post by icebox on May 17, 2018 21:29:19 GMT
Thanks! Would the pan of hot water placed in the evaporator and letting it run help with that? I've probably haven't let it run longer than 30 minutes as before it would immediately begin cooling. Is there a point at which allowing it to run would damage the compressor? BTW, I just found your youtube videos today, thank you so much for documenting and putting them out there!!! www.youtube.com/watch?v=GBZ6gLzAYB0I would say that 30 minutes should not hurt the compressor, as long as it's not drawing excess power. I would just run it 5 minutes at a time with some rest periods in between. It may be that the start / stop cycles are helpful for the compressor if there's something inside stuck or plugged.
Again thanks for watching my videos! Very happy you find them helpful. I enjoy this type of tinkering and problem solving as well!
Yes I would agree, I've once had this happen when transporting a fridge on its side, once the slug of oil is in the condenser it does take some time to shift. 5 minutes run and a rest should be good. But it may take some time time to shift. Let's hope that's what it is. |
|
|
|
Post by dcraven on May 25, 2018 19:55:52 GMT
I've tried letting it run for 5 minutes off and on, as well as the pan of hot water placed in the evaporator but no luck. It doesn't feel like either the compressor or condenser are getting hot. Is there something else I can try or is it time to test for leaks and vacuum the system? If so where on this fridge would you tap in or solder a schrader valve? My preference would be the later as taps seem prone to leaking. I've included pictures of the compressor and refrigerant lines to hopefully help identify where to hook into the system Front view  Top left corner  Right side  Left side  |
|
|
|
Post by turbokinetic on May 26, 2018 3:15:02 GMT
I've tried letting it run for 5 minutes off and on, as well as the pan of hot water placed in the evaporator but no luck. It doesn't feel like either the compressor or condenser are getting hot. Is there something else I can try or is it time to test for leaks and vacuum the system? If so where on this fridge would you tap in or solder a schrader valve? My preference would be the later as taps seem prone to leaking. I've included pictures of the compressor and refrigerant lines to hopefully help identify where to hook into the system
Sorry this hasn't started working for you. Very sad.
Do you still hear noises from the evaporator when it runs?
As for the charge port, I like the factory "mounted and stable" ports the machine came with. If you don't want to locate a kit to connect to those, you can do what I did on my Frigidaire. I drilled out the threads in the original fitting (Oh the horror!) and then installed a modern Schrader service port in that. It looks semi-factory. Did you have a chance to see that?
|
|
|
|
Post by dcraven on May 26, 2018 13:53:40 GMT
I do still hear gurgling noises from the evaporator, even after you turn it off the noise continue. Makes me think it's likely oil has clogged up a line somewhere but how to clear it without getting access into the system?
I believe I did see in your video what you did, I'll rewatch it though this weekend I'm going to be rewiring the electrical system for the truck in my profile picture. Is the factory port what you see in the picture above labeled "left side" that is sticking out the compressor covered with a hard rubber material?
|
|
|
|
Post by turbokinetic on May 26, 2018 14:10:29 GMT
I do still hear gurgling noises from the evaporator, even after you turn it off the noise continue. Makes me think it's likely oil has clogged up a line somewhere but how to clear it without getting access into the system? I believe I did see in your video what you did, I'll rewatch it though this weekend I'm going to be rewiring the electrical system for the truck in my profile picture. Is the factory port what you see in the picture above labeled "left side" that is sticking out the compressor covered with a hard rubber material?
I believe that the picture labeled "Top Left Corner" shows a service port in a line, with a rubber cover over it. That could also probably be a port on the compressor under the rubber cover as you pointed out.
Does this compressor have an unloader? I wonder if too much oil could have flowed out of the compressor housing, and now the unloader can't close, and therefore the compressor can't make enough pressure to push the oil around the system and back into its housing?
Good luck on the truck rewiring!
|
|
|
|
Post by Travis on May 26, 2018 15:50:03 GMT
The service ports are under the hard plastic caps. You have to break off those plastic caps they’re not removable and replaceable. Once you have them all you’ll see a hex head screw underneath that will be the service screw.
There’s not an unloader in that unit
|
|
