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Post by ckfan on Nov 28, 2016 15:13:15 GMT
Ever since I brought home this 1941 Frigidaire Cold Wall from Travis's friends garage I knew it was special. Chilling coils throughout the interior walls, big and spacious freezer which gets down to 0 degrees, a soft gentle purr, a light bulb which may very well be original to the machine. Add to that a very nice interior and exterior and I really thought that this machine was something special. I was conducting a power trial on it and was trying to see whether or not it would meet or exceed 2016 Energy Star standards. Before that though I was freezing some desserts (which were quite tasty) that I got recipes from the cold wall instruction manual. I went in to check on the desserts and everything seemed fine. Then I just had the random thought to check the compressor underneath, I don't know why. I went to pull the front cover off and I saw a trail of oil in the grout line of my tile floor. Uh oh. When I pulled off the cover my worst fears were confirmed. There, at one of the electrical terminals, was oil dripping from the compressor. I immediately shut off the unit and surveyed the damage. I'm not entirely sure but I think that the unit still has most, if not all, of its charge left. I have no easy way to confirm this of course but it was still freezing stuff fine when I checked on it. Unfortunately the old rubber seal around the terminal just gave way due to old age. I feel so bad for it. I am hoping that there is something that I could do for it but I am doubtful. After talking with Gill I tried to tighten the nut for the offending terminal. I did seem to be able to tighten it a bit but not much. I couldn't get my socket to fit properly over the nut for some reason. I don't know if it is corrosion or just collected gunk but there was a lot of goop and gunk on my socket. I put a paper towel under the compressor and terminal to see if any more oil would leak out over night. Fortunately none did. I really don't know what to do next. I know it is a terribly long shot at this point but I would love to save this beauty if at all possible. Heck, even my roommate said "oh no!" when I told him which one had fallen. It seems like everyone who has seen it likes this machine. To view the photos in this post, please follow this link: drive.google.com/open?id=0B8_jm7K-ahMaSHpCbFZ2SkZCaG8 |
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Post by ckfan on Nov 28, 2016 16:52:25 GMT
Just did some digging around on some other HVAC forums and found these little gems. There are 3 left from a wholesale internet shop. I am really tempted to buy them even though I wouldn't know where to begin once I got them! If you notice it says that these seals fit Westinghouse and Frigidaire compressors among many others. Apparently they all used similar seals. Very interesting stuff. I wonder if this poor thing could be repaired after all!? To view the photo in this post, please follow this link: drive.google.com/open?id=0B8_jm7K-ahMaSHpCbFZ2SkZCaG8 |
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Post by coldspaces on Nov 29, 2016 3:03:09 GMT
Those seals would probably fix your leak. They will not replace all the old rubber seal that is down inside the terminal. Since yours is just leaking and not shorted out these should work. If you could chill the box till the system was just above atmospheric pressure and keep it there you could install these with the r114 still in the system.
As far as tightening the old one you will first have to get the top nut loose, then turn the back nut tighter, all while never letting the stud turn in the seal. Not always a easy thing to do, usually need some thin wrenches to do it. As you saw I double nutted the end of the stud to be able to keep it from turning while i loosed the back nut on the poor old Westy compressor. You can do that to keep stud from turning while you snug up the back nut also. Don't tighten to much!
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Post by coldspaces on Nov 29, 2016 14:07:54 GMT
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Post by ckfan on Nov 29, 2016 14:59:05 GMT
I know this is a stupid question but this is simply uncharted territory for me...
When you say "get the box" to 45F do you mean get the evaporator / freezer box down to that temp or the whole kit and caboodle? I'm imagining taking the whole thing outside on a cold day but then it would be tough to get the temperature and pressure right where I want it. Wouldn't want to suck air in I suppose.
I also am having trouble envisioning how to do the process of removal and installation. The current nuts that I see are housed in little plastic covers, IE, you have to have a thin wall socket to get to them. I'm not sure how I am going to have two nuts on the end to hold the stud while trying to loosen that top nut. I hope that makes sense. I will post some pictures of its current state with the electrical top "nuts" removed. I'm assuming that once the "top" nut is free I will remove it and then tighten the back nut to "just snug" while holding the stud? Then I guess it would be as simple as putting the new seal over the back nut and then tighten the new nut? God, this is confusing to me. I know it should be simple but for some reason I am having a problem with envisioning it.
I really appreciate your help. I thought this fridge was dead. Maybe I can resurrect it with your help.
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Post by coldspaces on Nov 30, 2016 1:05:51 GMT
I think it would be easier to try to keep temp even if you cool the complete frig to 40-45F rather than cool just the evap. Your right though about it would be had to get the temp to stay even enough out doors.
I forgot about the back nut being down in the insulator. I would get a thin wall socket, cut it sort and weld a handle on it. I would have the center open to allow the stud to stick trough so I can hold the stud.
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Post by ckfan on Nov 30, 2016 3:09:06 GMT
That is an amazing solution but beyond my means at the moment. Damn.
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Post by coldspaces on Nov 30, 2016 4:39:57 GMT
That is an amazing solution but beyond my means at the moment. Damn. We live to far apart, to bad it couldn't have happened sooner, you could have added it to the u haul load. |
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Post by timeswelding on Nov 30, 2016 11:25:59 GMT
That is an amazing solution but beyond my means at the moment. Damn. It's a very good solution that's very much within your means. Get a socket of the proper wall thickness and bring it to Ohio with you Sunday. We'll modify it while you're here. |
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Post by ckfan on Nov 30, 2016 15:01:07 GMT
That is an amazing solution but beyond my means at the moment. Damn. It's a very good solution that's very much within your means. Get a socket of the proper wall thickness and bring it to Ohio with you Sunday. We'll modify it while you're here. Thanks Doug! That is very nice of you. I'm going to have to find a very thin walled socket because it is a very tight fit. |
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Post by Travis on Dec 27, 2016 23:58:21 GMT
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Post by ckfan on Dec 28, 2016 0:04:39 GMT
Wow, that looks so similar to mine. That makes me want to get mine going that much more. Hmm...
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Post by Travis on Dec 28, 2016 0:08:59 GMT
That one is little old lady fresh. The top is protected with a blanket.
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Post by ckfan on Jan 18, 2017 15:13:08 GMT
It lives!!! I've got the cold wall up and running again! Travis put a boot to my rear and told me that I needed to get off my tuckus and get to work on it. I'm glad I listened. While I wasn't paying attention to it, it had leaked more oil onto the paper towel that I put underneath the compressor. That kind of worried me. I decided to contact Gill (coldspaces) and pick his experienced brain. He told me to go for it and to not worry about the oil leakage. I thought that it would be dangerously low on oil but he thought that it would be fine. He was right. He walked me through the necessary steps and entertained my questions of worry for my other fridges with these types of seals. Long story short, he told me to not bother "fixing" the fridges that aren't broke and to go ahead with the fix on this one that was broken. I'm sorry your dinner was presumably cold by the time you got off the phone with me Gill! I prepared myself mentally and decided to give it a go. I moved the fridge to my covered back porch a few hours previous to talking to Gill. This gave the whole fridge a chance to cool down. The reason for this was to get the internal pressure down to a level just above atmospheric. I used my heat gun to measure the temp and after a few hours in front of my industrial fan it was ready. 45 degrees is the magic number to get R114 down to just above atmospheric pressure. I set up a good light and went to work. I used the very handy, and necessary, tool that Doug made for me to get the nut out of the plastic housing surrounding it. Doug, thank you so much. It worked great. Even with my terrible explanation of what I needed and no real measurements he was able to make a tool that did exactly what it was supposed to do. It even felt good in my hand thanks to him making a custom handle with rounded edges. No cut fingers! Once the nut was removed I tried to get the second nut out. Huh, there was no second nut. It was just down to the plastic insulator that surrounded the bolt. I decided to carefully pull it out with a pair of vice grips. They came out easily. Now the real culprits were exposed. As you can see in one of the pictures what was left was the stud protruding from the compressor and a larger nut surrounding it. This larger nut seems to be soldered into the side of the dome but I can't tell for sure. This nut is what the plastic insulators were riding on. In between the nut and the stud was this weird, red colored, insulating fiber board like material. This was the leaky culprit. On the terminal that was leaking, you could see extremely tiny bubbles where the R114 was slowly escaping around the seal between the fiber board and the stud. This is where the new add on seals come in. They have a conical shape which fit perfectly between the nut and the stud and pressed up against both the nut and the fiber board inside the nut. Very cool. All it took was a simple tighten of a new nut which put pressure on the seal and made it seat. I finished up the rest of the terminals and then waited for a leak to develop. After an hour I could not see any oil seepage so I decided to hook up the power and see if it still had life in it. Surprisingly after an initial clatter from the compressor on start up (it always does that when it hasn't been started for a while) it got super quiet just like normal. After a bit I could hear boiling in the freezer section. I knew I was in business. Now, the whole fridge was still out on my back porch so it wasn't working hard at all but after a few hours it was able to reach double digit negative temperatures in the freezer as indicated by the one picture. You can see the freezer and the outside temp on the digital thermostat. I was happy with that so I decided to turn it off. The thermostat clicked off at 6 out of 7. Also a great sign. Tonight I am going to brush down the compressor and condenser coil and lines and give them a good coating of rust proofing paint. They need it. I am also going to do the same to the ceiling in the freezer section, it has peeling paint. I know that I am not out of the woods yet, higher house temperatures and or a leak that may not be properly fixed may come to bite me in the end. However, I feel like I have taken something that was dying and have made it well again. I feel like there is hope for this fridge yet. I couldn't have done it without the great help of this community. Travis, Doug, and Gill, you are all great people and I really am appreciative of your help. I am sorry that I didn't fix this sooner. I was honestly scared that I was going to mess something up. In reality nothing could have been easier. To view the photos in this post, please follow this link: drive.google.com/open?id=0B8_jm7K-ahMaSHpCbFZ2SkZCaG8 |
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Post by timeswelding on Jan 18, 2017 16:16:06 GMT
I'm glad you got it up and running again. It sure looks like we got lucky. Had we made the socket ever so slightly larger in diameter, it wouldn't have fit. Great news!
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