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Post by turbokinetic on Jul 4, 2018 18:28:39 GMT
Thanks for the video links! I want to hear them so will have to wait until I get home from mom and dad's place. Laptop speakers are blown.
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Post by elec573 on Jul 5, 2018 6:35:04 GMT
Good idea to put it through it’s paces before you doctor it all up . With the drs you just don’t know until you run them for a while!
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Post by turbokinetic on Jul 5, 2018 13:16:14 GMT
Excellent! I usually let mine run for a few days or weeks to put them through the paces as well. Adjusting for the soldering iron, the watts are typical. The sounds different DRs make under different conditions are fascinating. Yours sounds a bit on the loud side, but then again they tend to be a bit louder in high ambients, and videos make them appear louder than they really are. For comparison: Typical running of my DR2 photos.app.goo.gl/Hg3dDGcAtps3TGTGAMy DRA2 during pulldown, and how sensitive it is to refrigerant in the oil (by varying the leveling of the machine) photos.app.goo.gl/dog7fJKDozNn5Kh89Typical running for that DRA2: photos.app.goo.gl/tEJdHE3NpNdCkUpm9Thw same DRA2 at the end of its cycle on a really hot day (notice the slight whistling tone) photos.app.goo.gl/C6r2Fyg1NtgjD2Zw8Hi Aaron, I finally got to listen to the videos! Your DRA2 in the last video sounds more similar to my D2 unit in my video. I believe the high ambient temperature in the storage room at my place caused mine to sound like it does in the video. I was out there this morning around 06:30 when it was still reasonably cool (in the low 80's at most). It sounded much quieter. Even in the afternoon, it's gotten quieter as the days have gone by. May have just needed to run some more.
I made two full trays of ice yesterday and it did very well. The ice was beginning to freeze after about 30 minutes, at which time I had to leave. When I returned it was fully frozen.
I was reading through the DR service manual and happened upon some interesting info in the "odd frequency and DC models" section. As we know, they sold a rotary converter to allow operation of these machines from DC supplies. They talk about using them on a "farm light plant" system. If you're not familiar this was an early off-grid electrical system which consisted of one of two possible designs. One was a generator that switched on automatically whenever there was a closed circuit to any load; and then stopped when the load was removed. It put a small DC voltage on the generator output and measured for this to be "shunted" by any load connected. The generator would start once this DC sending voltage was shunted out. It would then remain running as long as current was flowing from the generator to the load.
The other farm light plant design used a battery bank and the generator would start to charge the batteries, and stop when they were full, based on voltage of the bank.
In the manual, they actually mention a situation where the DR crankcase heater would prevent the generator from shutting down at the end of the refrigeration cycle, because the heater would continue to pull power and the generator would see a load and therefore stay running. They talked about reconfiguring the heater wiring at the control; so that it is only on while the compressor is running.
That sounded as if it would defeat the reason for the heater (standby heating). So, I got curious and turned off my soldering iron simulated heater with the refrigerator running. It does make a difference in the sound of the compressor, even during a sustained run cycle. Maybe the reasoning GE had was that any heater operation was better than none; and the "heater only when running" was an acceptable compromise.
I had initially expected that the use of the heater after the compressor was already fully warmed up would not matter. I guess it does!
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Post by ckfan on Jul 5, 2018 23:42:24 GMT
Yes, I wondered about that too when I read that. I guess you are right. They figured that some heat is better than none. They probably also had no idea how to make it work just like it would on normal mains power. They like their heat. That’s for sure.
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Post by turbokinetic on Jul 5, 2018 23:49:07 GMT
Yes, I wondered about that too when I read that. I guess you are right. They figured that some heat is better than none. They probably also had no idea how to make it work just like it would on normal mains power. They like their heat. That’s for sure.
This early technology just fascinates me. Really does.
As for the DR, it seems to be running quieter and running less as it is used. I think it's just needing to wake up from being laid up for so long.
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Post by birkie on Jul 6, 2018 1:19:54 GMT
They talk about using them on a "farm light plant" system. If you're not familiar this was an early off-grid electrical system which consisted of one of two possible designs. One was a generator that switched on automatically whenever there was a closed circuit to any load; and then stopped when the load was removed. I have to admit I've sort of skimmed that section of the manual, but that little tidbit is fascinating! So I'm guessing something like this setup would have been contemporary to the DRs? youtu.be/BxrnxoJ5VSoI wonder if any of the DC models still exist; they would be museum pieces for sure! Yeah - there is a lot I still don't understand about this, but from what I've gathered from observing the things run is that refrigerant can condense in the sump both in the 'on' cycle and the 'off' cycle. I've thought about wiring the heater to be off during either the 'on' or 'off' cycle, but that doesn't seem to work out that well. I'm almost convinced that despite the presence of the heater, some refrigerant usually ends up condensing in the sump during the 'on' cycle anyway that needs to be driven off during the 'off' cycle.
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Post by turbokinetic on Jul 6, 2018 1:47:29 GMT
They talk about using them on a "farm light plant" system. If you're not familiar this was an early off-grid electrical system which consisted of one of two possible designs. One was a generator that switched on automatically whenever there was a closed circuit to any load; and then stopped when the load was removed. I have to admit I've sort of skimmed that section of the manual, but that little tidbit is fascinating! So I'm guessing something like this setup would have been contemporary to the DRs? youtu.be/BxrnxoJ5VSoYes! That's it exactly. I would so love to have one of those Delco Light plants. I am a generator service engineer by trade, so that is especially fascinating to me. That would be another definite Bucket List artifact for sure!!!
Makes sense. The heat from the motor is generated in the stator, up in the dome of the compressor. The bottom of the compressor is insulated, but it is above the fridge cabinet where there could be some heat transfer downwards from it. Refrigerant will condense on the sides of the dome as well as the inside of the condenser coil, assuming the dome is not slightly hotter than the condenser. If it turns out that the lower portion of the compressor, where the suction line goes through the housing, possibly? could have a cool region, it could plausibly collect refrigerant as the unit runs.
I contacted the place shown in the heater thread, but haven't yet heard back from them. Until that time, the soldering iron is getting some abuse LOL!
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Post by birkie on Jul 6, 2018 3:02:51 GMT
If it turns out that the lower portion of the compressor, where the suction line goes through the housing, possibly? could have a cool region, it could plausibly collect refrigerant as the unit runs. Come to think of it, there is quite a bit of surface area that might be cool enough to condense. Aside from the suction line coiling around the compressor twice (to allow for vibration), there is a "surge chamber" that serves to collect any slugs of liquid refrigerant that come up from the evaporators (though I really think the purpose of that chamber is for dampening the suction pulses first and foremost. I have no idea if liquid refrigerant can even make it that far). Diagram of the surge chamber:
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Post by turbokinetic on Jul 6, 2018 3:18:11 GMT
If it turns out that the lower portion of the compressor, where the suction line goes through the housing, possibly? could have a cool region, it could plausibly collect refrigerant as the unit runs. Come to think of it, there is quite a bit of surface area that might be cool enough to condense. Aside from the suction line coiling around the compressor twice (to allow for vibration), there is a "surge chamber" that serves to collect any slugs of liquid refrigerant that come up from the evaporators (though I really think the purpose of that chamber is for dampening the suction pulses first and foremost. I have no idea if liquid refrigerant can even make it that far). Diagram of the surge chamber: Very nice diagram. Yeah I forgot about the coiled suction line in the housing! High-side domes are a foreign concept that I am still having to keep straight in my head. I'm sure that an overcharge could put refrigerant that far. One of my Frigidaires has the first few inches of the return line frosted. I probably put a little too much in it after repairing the puncture. I'm sure if more was added, it would have no where to go but back to the compressor.
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Post by turbokinetic on Aug 7, 2018 16:00:06 GMT
So, just a quick update. I have not been running this machine because of the heater situation. I was able to order a heater from Nordic last week, after finally getting in touch with them about their broken online ordering system. They are manufacturing (or importing) the heater. Once it is ready to ship from Canada; they will contact me again.
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Post by turbokinetic on Sept 23, 2018 2:21:07 GMT
Just want to make a quick update on my DR. I received the heaters from Nordic and installed on into this fridge. It makes a significant difference in the startup sound and how quickly it starts cooling. I don't feel painfully guilty every time I start it now LOL!
You can just barely see the new wires in there!
While I was at it, I decided to go ahead and refurbish the emblems. Someone has painted the entire fridge in that awful nicotine-stain yellow house paint. It's obviously been painted with a brush.
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Post by birkie on Sept 23, 2018 12:47:30 GMT
Just want to make a quick update on my DR. I received the heaters from Nordic and installed on into this fridge. It makes a significant difference in the startup sound and how quickly it starts cooling.
That's great news! I'm kind of surprised the higher wattage soldering iron was so ineffective, but I guess it's all about delivering the heat to the right spot to avoid refrigerant collecting in the deepest depths of that sump.
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Post by turbokinetic on Sept 23, 2018 12:51:16 GMT
Just want to make a quick update on my DR. I received the heaters from Nordic and installed on into this fridge. It makes a significant difference in the startup sound and how quickly it starts cooling.
That's great news! I'm kind of surprised the higher wattage soldering iron was so ineffective, but I guess it's all about delivering the heat to the right spot to avoid refrigerant collecting in the deepest depths of that sump. It seems that the soldering iron didn't have good thermal contact with the inside of the heater well. It may have just heated up the housing (the outer shell of the compressor) more than the oil heater well its self! The heater goes "way down on" the well, whereas the soldering iron wasn't able to fit in as far.
Also, I wrapped the heater with aluminum tape, building it up to where it was a "light press fit" into the heater well. Should have great thermal conductivity!
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