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Post by ChrisJ on Feb 17, 2016 3:12:47 GMT
I appreciate all the input guys. Chris, just to confirm, yours is not wired like mine in the diagram above? (My neutral goes through the relay.) Hi Thom,best I can tell yours is wired the same. The neutral goes to the line cord connection not the relay it self. It goes to the relay assembly but that's all.
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Post by Travis on Feb 17, 2016 3:17:30 GMT
Chris,
For the sake of clarity, would it be possible for you to remove the relay base and make a diagram? That way we will all know how it works forever.
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thom
New Member
Posts: 22
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Post by thom on Feb 17, 2016 5:03:15 GMT
"The neutral goes to the line cord connection not the relay it self. It goes to the relay assembly but that's all."
Sorry but that is confusing to me. Mine is currently wired exactly as in the diagram I posted. So the white neutral from the power cord is connected through the relay to one end of the coil and the other end of the coil is connected to the red run wire to the compressor, so at some point there is current running through it. It is not just connected to the assembly or housing of the relay.
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Post by ChrisJ on Feb 17, 2016 11:31:46 GMT
"The neutral goes to the line cord connection not the relay it self. It goes to the relay assembly but that's all." Sorry but that is confusing to me. Mine is currently wired exactly as in the diagram I posted. So the white neutral from the power cord is connected through the relay to one end of the coil and the other end of the coil is connected to the red run wire to the compressor, so at some point there is current running through it. It is not just connected to the assembly or housing of the relay. Hi Thom. Sorry for the confusion you're 100% right the white line white does exactly that, I was referring to the black incoming which by modern standards would be hot. I don't think it matters which side of the wall socket it ends up connected to though.
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Post by ChrisJ on Feb 17, 2016 13:52:36 GMT
Thom,
The single line in (shown in the previous pictures) you're going to use on the RO81 connects to #6 on the schematic which is from the line cord. Red connects to red going to the compressor, and white connects to white going to the compressor. Do not touch #2. You will of course need to completely remove the original relay from the relay base. You will need to carefully drill holes into the relay base to route the wires.
Once you confirm the relay works properly I would remove the two unused black wires as was done to mine in the pictures I posted.
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Post by Travis on Feb 17, 2016 17:06:56 GMT
Chris,
A supco relay will not fit inside the shell of this original relay. The shell is more like a type R relay, but a little thinner.
Just to clarify again:
a/c line white goes to one of the smaller black wires on the supco relay a/c line black goes to the compressor black
supco white goes to compressor white (starting) supco red goes to compressor red (running)
Please delete or change this if it's wrong.
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Post by ChrisJ on Feb 17, 2016 17:20:37 GMT
It's right Travis.
Only thing is, I honestly don't believe it matters which AC line goes where, it's not a polarized plug. I've had mine connected both ways.
It's also important that it goes to the black wire on the RO81 shown in my pictures.
The relay gets hidden between the fins on a CK if I remember correctly? Shouldn't matter if the cover doesn't work, but thanks for letting me know.
We really need to get a thread put together just for this with good pictures for multiple machines.
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Post by Travis on Feb 17, 2016 17:47:03 GMT
Chris,
Do you think it matters which black wire on the supco you use? It looks like they used the one closest to that useless side clip.
I have installed an ro81 on later flat top machines. Since those models have a dedicated control wire, compressor wire and power cord, I haven't ever not used wires on the relay. I will say that I haven't seen a ck unit that didn't need to be rewired. Once you move either the compressor or control leads, you can have trouble internally. Now that I know how relatively easy it is to rewire I won't do it any other way
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Post by ckfan on Feb 17, 2016 18:06:35 GMT
Eventually I am going to re wire my CK. I have to admit that I am a little scared to tackle it though. If I could work together with someone giving me guidance I would gladly take pictures of the process and post them. I am just afraid of accidentally causing a leak in the system as I am not sure how to get to the underbelly of the compressor. I also would be interested in replacing the relay with an RO81 at the same time to make it super reliable. Has anyone ever found the need to file the points in the control to increase their reliability?
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Post by Travis on Feb 17, 2016 18:15:49 GMT
You don't have to bother the refrigeration lines to rewire.
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Post by ChrisJ on Feb 17, 2016 18:42:24 GMT
Chris, Do you think it matters which black wire on the supco you use? It looks like they used the one closest to that useless side clip.
I have installed an ro81 on later flat top machines. Since those models have a dedicated control wire, compressor wire and power cord, I haven't ever not used wires on the relay. I will say that I haven't seen a ck unit that didn't need to be rewired. Once you move either the compressor or control leads, you can have trouble internally. Now that I know how relatively easy it is to rewire I won't do it any other way Yes, You must use that one. I believe the other top wire is just connected directly to the output common so trying to use it wouldn't do anything. I won't know until I get another RO81 to mess around with. I really don't want to play around with my main refrigerator for obvious reasons. Ok, it's our second, main refrigerator but all of my stuff is in it.
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Post by coldspaces on Feb 17, 2016 21:23:06 GMT
After talking to Travis today I now understand more about how Chrsjs relay was modified. It might be possible to just use something like the Supco ICG1 relay. Leave the original cold control, overload and wiring in place and wire this in to control the start winding. www.supco.com/images/09%20relay%20&%20hardstarts.pdf
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Post by ChrisJ on Feb 17, 2016 21:59:06 GMT
After talking to Travis today I now understand more about how Chrsjs relay was modified. It might be possible to just use something like the Supco ICG1 relay. Leave the original cold control, overload and wiring in place and wire this in to control the start winding. www.supco.com/images/09%20relay%20&%20hardstarts.pdfThe main reason I went with the RO81, or as Mike Arnold sold it to me, "the solid state relay" was because it had an overload and he seemed to think the original overloads may not be reliable. Gill, what are your thoughts on the two common leads being unhooked, or rather, missing? Do they actually do anything that you know of?
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Post by coldspaces on Feb 17, 2016 22:09:50 GMT
After talking to Travis today I now understand more about how Chrsjs relay was modified. It might be possible to just use something like the Supco ICG1 relay. Leave the original cold control, overload and wiring in place and wire this in to control the start winding. www.supco.com/images/09%20relay%20&%20hardstarts.pdfThe main reason I went with the RO81, or as Mike Arnold sold it to me, "the solid state relay" was because it had an overload and he seemed to think the original overloads may not be reliable. Gill, what are your thoughts on the two common leads being unhooked, or rather, missing? Do they actually do anything that you know of? I would think you have deleted the overload and are only using the relay part of the RO81. The overload in it probably trips off the common wire to the compressor but I don't have a drawing of the internal wiring to go by.
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Post by ChrisJ on Feb 17, 2016 22:13:52 GMT
The main reason I went with the RO81, or as Mike Arnold sold it to me, "the solid state relay" was because it had an overload and he seemed to think the original overloads may not be reliable. Gill, what are your thoughts on the two common leads being unhooked, or rather, missing? Do they actually do anything that you know of? I would think you have deleted the overload and are only using the relay part of the RO81. The overload in it probably trips off the common wire to the compressor but I don't have a drawing of the internal wiring to go by. I'm 90% sure I had the overload trip once after starting the machine in a hot warehouse with the original float valve. The compressor shut off for no apparent reason, the thermostat certainly wasn't satisfied and I didn't reset the factory overload. I'm going to send Supco and email and see if they will respond with some info. They were willing to send me the specifications on the RO81 previously so you never know.
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