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Post by thedman on Jul 9, 2019 2:23:54 GMT
Keep my fingers crossed. Now I need to locate an additional rack and the glass tray.
Donald
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Post by elec573 on Jul 9, 2019 3:17:29 GMT
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Post by turbokinetic on Jul 9, 2019 11:48:32 GMT
Got the hinges on and the door works. I'm not sure why the difference but, they work... I had the heater running for 4 hours before I started her up. She's purring nicely so far. I set it to 5 and put a thermometer in the bottom. We'll she what happens. Tomorrow, I might try the bleeding trick, depending on what I find in the morning. This is an awesome group. Thank you for the great suggestions. Thanks again, Donald
Yes; the bleeding of NCG's is not difficult; but it can be intimidating. The problem is; if the system hasn't been bled in decades, it can put too much stress on the compressor and cause it to seize up. It can survive this one or two times, but eventually the cumulative damage will cause it to fail completely. It's best to do a bleed procedure once when you first acquire it if there's any chance it needs it.
In the thread linked above, the factory procedure is explained with regards to heating up the system and purging and waiting times. It's important to start out cautiously and avoid losing refrigerant. But, if there is an excess of NCG in the system it can become a very long process.
Another helpful thing I learned is to attach a piece of clear vinyl tubing to the charge port. With this tubing filled with oil, it will allow you to have a much better "sight gauge" to see if the oil is drawing in, or if there are NCG's purging out.
I recently managed to un-seize one of these which had been sitting in a junk pile for years. It had such an extreme level of NCG that it was actually under high pressure while the machine was stopped and cold. This represents an extreme case of NCG buildup. I recommend pre-bleeding the system, with the unit stopped and cool, to check for this condition. The boiling point of methyl formate is around 89°F; so the unit will need to be in a room at less than this temperature. If it's outdoors in summer time, it will continue to purge refrigerant vapor. When I did the unit in the linked video, it was winter time. So, to summarize the pre-bleeding process; you would follow these steps: 1 - Allow the unit to sit in an air-conditioned room overnight with heater unplugged. 2 - Attach sight hose to service port and fill with oil. 3 - Open port and allow any pressure which may be present to escape. Allow it to escape until the unit is at atmospheric pressure. 4 - Ensure port is tightly closed.
Once this above has been done, put the heater back in service; then after it's had time to heat up, run the unit and perform the factory bleeding procedure.
Here's a video with some info in it. This was a very severe case of neglect; and it was the first time I had dealt with one of these - so it was a learning curve for me.
youtu.be/gTLokfkRyfU
Hope this helps! Sincerely, David
EDIT: Picture of the vinyl tube as a sight glass: Bleeding NCG's. That is a vinyl tube of AB oil, to see the bubbles and keep air from drawing back in. Note that is a Bristol key wrench, not a Torx and not an Allen key. Due to the extremely tight nature of the port, if the wrong wrench is used, often it will be stripped out.
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Post by thedman on Jul 9, 2019 18:49:46 GMT
She was 40 degrees this morning and I just checked and she's still at 40 and set just a little below 40. All the coils on the top are warm so, maybe I don't have a problem at the moment with NCG's? Thank you again, you guys are great. I wish I could post pictures.
Donald
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Post by turbokinetic on Jul 9, 2019 19:11:57 GMT
She was 40 degrees this morning and I just checked and she's still at 40 and set just a little below 40. All the coils on the top are warm so, maybe I don't have a problem at the moment with NCG's? Thank you again, you guys are great. I wish I could post pictures. Donald That's great to hear. It does indeed sound like you're not suffering from NCG's. One of the things GE found out and indicated in service literature was that certain units develop NCG's more rapidly than others. Yours was probably a "clean build" and hasn't had anything in the system to catalyze the breakdown of methyl formate into NCG's.
Again, great that it's running well for you! Sincerely, David
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mygemt
New Member
Hi....I'm a brand new member here. Can someone tell me how to post? Not sure....thanks!
Posts: 8
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Post by mygemt on Jul 10, 2019 1:56:42 GMT
Just got my first monitor top home. The ad says it was professionally restored by the previous owner. It was left in the house and the new home owners don't want it. I have no idea what "restored" means anymore as the door gasket is hard, there are two racks missing and I'm sure the top seal needs to be replaced (what is that waxy stuff?). How do you find out what kind of refrigerant was used in it? Best regards and thank you for your help. Donald Cochrane philcokid@gmail.com
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mygemt
New Member
Hi....I'm a brand new member here. Can someone tell me how to post? Not sure....thanks!
Posts: 8
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Post by mygemt on Jul 10, 2019 22:13:53 GMT
Hi,
New member here trying to learn how to post questions and comments.
As far as moving fridges when I was young we owned a moving and storage company and moved thousands of appliances. Refrigerators are different in that it is always best not to lay them down if at all possible. If you have to, once the unit is in place it is a good idea not to turn the fridge on for 24 hours. This gives the oil a chance to go back into the compressor. You can get lucky and have it work, but better safe than sorry.
We had three methods of moving refrigerators depending on the available room. Most common was the appliance dolly with a strap that was tightened on a ratchet mechanism. You want to make sure the hinges on the door are on the opposite side to you. This way the doors cannot open when you tilt it.
The second way and probably the best for the monitor top is a two dolly system actually used to move pianos and organs. It is called a Roll or Carry. There are two shorter dollies with nice wooden handles that fold out. The fridge is in the middle and it is strapped onto both sides of the dolly. One man on each side if possible. The best part of this is that there is landing gear on the dolly. You step on this mechanism and it lifts the cargo up about 2 inches. Now you can roll with ease as far as you need to without any issues. Hope that helps someone.
Right now I have a 1936 GE that keeps starting and stopping ever minute or less. Can anyone suggest what to do? It still gets cool but it doesn't run long enough to get really cold. I think it could be a relay. Anyone have a problem they solved like this? Thanks in advance.
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Post by turbokinetic on Jul 10, 2019 23:30:04 GMT
Hi,
New member here trying to learn how to post questions and comments.
As far as moving fridges when I was young we owned a moving and storage company and moved thousands of appliances. Refrigerators are different in that it is always best not to lay them down if at all possible. If you have to, once the unit is in place it is a good idea not to turn the fridge on for 24 hours. This gives the oil a chance to go back into the compressor. You can get lucky and have it work, but better safe than sorry.
We had three methods of moving refrigerators depending on the available room. Most common was the appliance dolly with a strap that was tightened on a ratchet mechanism. You want to make sure the hinges on the door are on the opposite side to you. This way the doors cannot open when you tilt it.
The second way and probably the best for the monitor top is a two dolly system actually used to move pianos and organs. It is called a Roll or Carry. There are two shorter dollies with nice wooden handles that fold out. The fridge is in the middle and it is strapped onto both sides of the dolly. One man on each side if possible. The best part of this is that there is landing gear on the dolly. You step on this mechanism and it lifts the cargo up about 2 inches. Now you can roll with ease as far as you need to without any issues. Hope that helps someone.
Right now I have a 1936 GE that keeps starting and stopping ever minute or less. Can anyone suggest what to do? It still gets cool but it doesn't run long enough to get really cold. I think it could be a relay. Anyone have a problem they solved like this? Thanks in advance.
Hi, glad you are here and learning how to post on the forum! It can be somewhat a steep learning curve if you aren't familiar with forums in general.
Thanks for the moving tips, as well. I know it can be difficult to move these things! I just got back from a cross country roadtrip where I acquired several and had to unload them by myself.
As for the starting and stopping; that does sound like a stuck start-relay. That would mean the motor is staying in start mode and drawing too much current. The overload breaker is tripping and shutting it down to protect the motor.
I'm happy you asked about troubleshooting your fridge on our forum; but I want to offer a little bit of constructive criticism. There are many folks here with a lot of knowledge. We all look at new threads that are started in the forum, and then read the ones which interest us. Only a few of us move fridges around, and therefore this thread may not get a lot of views from the technical gurus. It would be best for you to open the area for the 1935 - 1937 models and start a new thread with a title describing your problem. monitortop.freeforums.net/board/4/ck-dk-lk-machines
That will get the right people looking at your question, sooner.
Sincerely, David
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Post by thedman on Jul 14, 2019 0:57:38 GMT
Now I have a new question to ask you guys. I went out to the garage in bare feet and got shocked when I touched the MT. Also, I put new feet on it the other day as it came without feet. I don't remember getting shocked before. Do these benefit from rotating the plug or grounding the unit?
Donald
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Post by turbokinetic on Jul 14, 2019 1:45:41 GMT
Now I have a new question to ask you guys. I went out to the garage in bare feet and got shocked when I touched the MT. Also, I put new feet on it the other day as it came without feet. I don't remember getting shocked before. Do these benefit from rotating the plug or grounding the unit? Donald I would say you need to find out how significant the earth fault is, before proceeding. It only takes a small amount of leakage current to cause a shock. Depending on the level of leakage current, a simple grounded plug could fix it. If there is an actual low resistance fault, you'll need to find and correct it. If there's a real fault and you put a grounded plug, it will short out and probably trip a breaker or burn some wiring in the fridge cabinet.
In each case where I've had a "shocker" to fix, it's been the cabinet light circuit. Moisture gets in the insulation and it causes the cloth / rubber wire to fault to the cabinet shell.
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Post by thedman on Jul 14, 2019 1:54:04 GMT
The only wiring I know has been replaced is the power cord. Would the fact that I put new feet on it have had something to do with this? Do I measure between the box and the ground on the wall plug? Could changing the polarity of the plug make any difference?
Donald
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Post by thedman on Jul 15, 2019 19:40:15 GMT
Hi Turbokinetic, If it is the light, how difficult is it to change the wiring? Do these have start capacitors?
Donald
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Post by turbokinetic on Jul 16, 2019 12:30:59 GMT
Hi Turbokinetic, If it is the light, how difficult is it to change the wiring? Do these have start capacitors? Donald Hi Donald. As for the light, it's not a terrible job, but the cooling unit (top) does have to come off the machine to access the lighting wiring. Anytime you disturb thing this old, there will be some difficulty due to deteriorated insulation etc.
There's no start capacitor - the motor is a split-phase-start type. It uses a low-inductance/high resistance start winding instead of a capacitor.
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Post by elec573 on Jul 17, 2019 2:45:42 GMT
You have a wire going to ground on the fridge somewhere which makes the fridge electrically hot . Now that you put feet (which are made up of some kind of plastic or rubber it’s insulated it from ground) now it’s going through you to ground . Electricity is always seeking the easiest path to ground weather it’s through you or in contact with earth it doesn’t have a conches!
Bottom line it needs new wiring all has been coved in the ca,ck section.
Also you can download a copy of the ca manual for free on this web site. We are here to answer questions but please look around this site almost all questions have been answered already !
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